Jungle Flavors RY4 Double
ConcreteRiver
Disclaimer: I didn't pay for these, shoutout to ECX for sending them to me.
Setup: Recoil w/ flavor barrel, Dual 12 wrap 24g 3.5mm SS316 @.31 ohms. 60w power, 450F temp limit. Full Cotton Wicks.
Testing: Jungle Flavors RY4 Double, 1 and 4%, 60/40 VG/PG base, Steeped 17 days.
Flavor Description: Mild dessert tobacco with heavy caramel and brown sugar sweetness.
This leads with a sticky, relatively full, soft caramel flavor. More of a caramel sauce, with some light vanilla and a bit of buttery richness. There's also a deeper brown sugar kind of sweetness that doesn't get absorbed by that caramel. You get a good deal of a molasses and some crispier caramelized sugar notes. I get a bit of an errant, raisin fruity note out of it, but it works pretty well with all that brown sugar.
There is some actual tobacco in this concentrate, which mostly shows up after that initial burst of sweetness. There's a pretty prominent dry hay note responsible for most of the throatiness of the concentrate, but I also get some darker tobacco leaf flavor. There's almost a light cocoa edge to it up against all that sweetness and caramel. The sweeter dessert portions of this tobacco definitely still headline but both those hay and dark tobacco notes are providing some solid accents especially on the tail end of the exhale.
Fairly full texture, especially with that caramel up front but doesn't seem to thin out too much at the end of the vape. Moderate throat hit from those grassier notes, but the rest of the flavor is warm and smooth. On balance, this is still an intensely sweet flavor but it's balanced a bit by the tobacco cleaning up some of that stickiness on the back end.
The primary competition here is TPA RY4 Double. They are both trying to go after the same profile, and fundamentally resemble each other but the JF version definitely punches a little harder. I think JF is a bit more concentrated, but really it's a deeper, fuller, and richer flavor. TPA is mostly a dirty caramel, but the JF really accentuates the heavy brown sugar bordering on raisiny sweetness on top of that. They have a similar kind of dry, warm throat hit, but the JF brings in some of the actual tobacco notes that are lacking in the TPA version. Overall the JF version seems much closer to an enjoyable solo RY4.
Off-flavors: Very caramel heavy and sweet for a tobacco. Probably not going to remind you much of smoking anything tobacco related by itself.
Throat Hit: Moderate, but it's a tobacco? Really unique kind of warm, almost scratchy throat hit that I don't really get anywhere else beyond this and TPA RY4.
Percentage testing: At 1%, this isn't really clicking . Sweetness is a little weak and one dimensional, not much caramel body or brown sugar nuance. Still a grassy, dry throat hit but not much in the way of a tobacco taste to it. Just a tiny bit watery instead of thick and smooth.
At 4% this is feeling pretty full. Heavy richer mouthfeel. Maybe a tiny bit thin for a caramel, but pretty full for a desert tobacco. I'm also getting some really clear brown sugar notes with a slightly fruity caramelized edge. Actual tobacco flavor is a bit easier to pick out on the back end as well.
Just based on these tests, I'd probably be around 4% as a primary flavor, and maybe 2.5% as an accent, but the tobacco here blends really well in an accent role. Just like the TPA version, a whole lot of this is going to be pretty subjective, and it doesn't really seem to have any off notes up at 6 and 8% as a S&V, but it's a bit too sticky and cloying for me that high.
Uses & Pairings: Should work as a direct sub for TPA at a similar percentage. Seems fuller rather than stronger per se at the same percentages, but maybe dial the JF back by .5% for a similar effect.
Solid desert tobacco though, and could probably work as a solo or with a bit of more aggressive tobacco to fill it out. In tobacco mixes, tends to drag stuff in a dessert pipe kind of direction, so maybe keep it away from your non-aromatic tobaccos if that isn't what you're going for.
RY4 double pairs really well with apples and pears in general. Can also stand up to darker, juicier fruits.
Tobacco notes are pretty subtle, works well in desserts and creams or custards for that caramel note. The tobacco in that application almost brings some savory earthiness to the profiles rather than comes across screaming "THIS IS A TOBACCO VAPE."
Second Opinions:
ELR page is sparse. One note from user "x47vapes": "Very good ry4 flavor. Stronger than tpa ry4 double."
Used in a couple of solid recipes on ATF. Recipe notes for CokeCan's "root_kit.exe" includes this description: "It's great. I know I love FA Soho, but this shit is just as good. Soho is mild and light, while RY4 Double has a deeper and darker note to it with hints of caramel and wood... JF RY4 Double doesn't need much steeping to be good. There's no weirdness to it straight away, and it just improves and pushes itself to the front of recipes after steeping. This concentrate is also great for both sides of the tobacco spectrum. If you like that flavour in your recipes, you'll notice it's tobacco body and be satisfied. If you aren't trying to fuck with tobacco flavours, this one will fuck your mouth with bakery notes of brown sugar and caramel."
Wayne at DIYorDIE gave a quick comparison of three RY4s including TPA, FA, and JF. His take was that JF is basically a more easily bullied version of TPA's. JF talk starts at 10:20
Here's the product page from ECX. Their description: "Those who love tobacco, RY4 double is a must have for your flavor station! RY4’s flavor profile is that of premium tobacco with hints of sweet caramel. This flavor pairs wells with creams, some fruit, and savory flavors!" I think they have the description completely backwards with the balance on caramel and tobacco. One five star review by hashslingingslashur titled: "This is great. Tried at 3% solo its a good shake and vape but really hits its stride at 2 weeks. This is leaps and bounds better than TFA ry4 double, so much so that I will never buy the TFA version again. Do yourself a favor and buy this please. It's got the same caramel/burnt sugar vibe as TFA, not getting a ton of tobacco either but who cares. This is damn delicious and I will be building recipes around it. could see this working anywhere you'd use the TFA version"